Recently I decided I wanted to get back into the SKS game. What a way to start. Found a '49 Tula refurb for a decent price in the Great White North.
Now, I am not nearly as versed in these rifles as some around these parts so tell me what you see!
(https://i.imgur.com/PJ7lLft.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PZgdkkQ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/2VbLGJW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/tlqNJzs.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/by8Hu7r.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/YO4XckW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PMgFXzc.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/sPvE3GC.jpg)
Once the frozen white stuff turns back into the proper form I'll be hitting a range to try it out!
Nice!
49's are great in any condition. Thanks for posting!
1949 date on the stock...hmmm. Did you get this from Westrifle?
That's beautiful.. I love those black spikers. Nice find!!
Quote from: Boris Badinov on February 21, 2019, 08:58:53 PM
1949 date on the stock...hmmm. Did you get this from Westrifle?
It's most certainly a Westrifle special. Not that i would ever turn my nose up at it, but that rifle was freshened up specifically to get the maximum profit out of the Canadian market.
Looks to be in great shape. thumb1
I purchased this from a fellow who bought it from 'Frontier Taxidermy' in Saskatchewan. He showed me the invoice for it as well. I have heard of West Rifle but have no dealings with them.
Thank you for all the info. I really did miss the 'glory days' when imports were plentiful and selection was vastly better than today's market up here.
I was happy to find a 1949 at all! I did not own one the first go-round so this is a treat for me.
It's hard to see from the pic, but does the magazine match?
I sure don't see the pin on the underside for the spring retaining post. :o
That may actually be original to the gun...if it is scrubbed and restamped, it received exactly what it was supposed to have at refurb...which is kind of a miracle, as is the correct magazine making it into its original gun after the magazines were pinned.
I really really would like a look inside the hinge area of that magazine....provided you can even see in there with the blaspheming five round conversion...I haven't seen how that style of modification looks on the inside. If that indeed has no pin on the floorplate...it would be a very elusive first generation magazine. Shortly into production, and possibly one of the first modifications was to include a post on the floor plate to retain a spring for the follower. It's a mystery what was going on in lieu of this...as all future SKSs had the post.
Everything I do see, points to almost everything being correct. Small stock ferrule, that is bottom pinned, which is great...but also points out how much they whittled down a regular hardwood stock to fit it. They didn't make stocks like that in 49...at refurb it seems common they did precisely this to accomodate the early design...but they wouldn't stamp it as a 49 stock...so as RM stated, some shenanigans were involved in that stock.
It would be interesting to see under the bayonet handle...there seems to be a taper where the edge meets the bayonet. If the bayonet has been removed, and the staking on the bolt is already disturbed some pics of the bayonet without the handle and spring would be interesting to see as well.
Gotta love a 49, each one has had a looong time for various things to have happened to them. It's great so many are popping up in Canada in a modern age...we are getting lots of SKS porn. drool2
Justin Hell - You can tell if the stock has been whittled down to fit spike bayonet by looking at end of stock. Here are pictures of both laminate stocks -early and later. You can see that if a later stock was cut down, the space between bayonet and cleaning rod would be a tell tale sign that it was modified.
https://ibb.co/gJYOew
looking good , thanks for sharing. clap1
It's a very nice rifle.
I like it.
It has a refurb mark on the receiver cover.The stock was shaped from a blade bayo stock (reinforcing pin missing from under the groove for fingers.) The magazine is right (doesn't have the pin for the follower spring.) The weld on the mag says it's from WestRifle.
I no longer have my 49, so I couldn't check on the reinforcing pin under groove. So I googled pictures and none showed pin on 49 carbine stock. My early laminate stock for spike does have reinforcing pin but it was probably made in 55+. Sabu243, could you remove stock and take a picture on end of stock, similar to my post #6. This should end debate of it being cut down from blade stock. Thanks.
Quote from: jaroslav on February 23, 2019, 08:05:04 PM
It has a refurb mark on the receiver cover.The stock was shaped from a blade bayo stock (reinforcing pin missing from under the groove for fingers.) The magazine is right (doesn't have the pin for the follower spring.) The weld on the mag says it's from WestRifle.
Hey Jaro, do you have insight into the different pinning options that have come and gone in the Canadian market? I'm familiar with the horrid frankenpinned spot welds on the outside, but there are other external pinned magazines I've seen that are quite different and then there are the nice internally pinned jobs too. Has anyone ever compiled a list of what's what on one of the Canadian forums?
r-m, I looked at my sks and found 2 different external(one frankenpinned) and 2 different internal pinned( different sized post, but connected same way) magazines. There could be multiple other styles out there. I can take some pictures in AM and post.
Quote from: jstin2 on February 23, 2019, 08:54:07 PM
I no longer have my 49, so I couldn't check on the reinforcing pin under groove. So I googled pictures and none showed pin on 49 carbine stock. My early laminate stock for spike does have reinforcing pin but it was probably made in 55+. Sabu243, could you remove stock and take a picture on end of stock, similar to my post #6. This should end debate of it being cut down from blade stock. Thanks.
I checked photos of my 1949, the stock does not have reinforcing pin. And front half of finger groove is much narrower than the rear half.
Justin Hell - The magazine does appear to match and appears to not be a scrubbed force matched replacement, but please fill me in if I'm out to lunch on this:
(https://i.imgur.com/BayaGJ6.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/fovkFQ0.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PaCIP6g.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/P7QRwiQ.jpg)
Oh, Canadaaaaaa! :(
(https://i.imgur.com/jleiM17.jpg)
Jstin2 - Here is the front stock ferrule and some other shots from different angles:
(https://i.imgur.com/Kjh8ggr.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Ri7fMG7.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/O4FuAYn.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/5LxtEhY.jpg)
running-man - This is the pinning style on my other carbine's magazine, much better than the '49 but still not fully internal like others I have come across:
(https://i.imgur.com/uQcezPt.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/M39hK58.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ePqDlXm.jpg)
Hey Jaro, do you have insight into the different pinning options that have come and gone in the Canadian market? I'm familiar with the horrid frankenpinned spot welds on the outside, but there are other external pinned magazines I've seen that are quite different and then there are the nice internally pinned jobs too. Has anyone ever compiled a list of what's what on one of the Canadian forums?
[/quote]
The other pinnings are a hollow rivet on the outside or a small pin welded inside the mag on the top of the follower arm. This style doesn't change the look of the mag.The problem with this pinning is the pin breaks loose and now you have illegal mag.
Quote from: jaroslav on February 24, 2019, 10:21:41 AM
Hey Jaro, do you have insight into the different pinning options that have come and gone in the Canadian market? I'm familiar with the horrid frankenpinned spot welds on the outside, but there are other external pinned magazines I've seen that are quite different and then there are the nice internally pinned jobs too. Has anyone ever compiled a list of what's what on one of the Canadian forums?
The other pinnings are a hollow rivet on the outside or a small pin welded inside the mag on the top of the follower arm. This style doesn't change the look of the mag.
The problem with this pinning is the pin breaks loose and now you have illegal mag.[/quote]
Not if you are in the US, and have a Canadian source. Then all you have is a tiny hole in the follower...that nobody sees. :) I wouldn't say I am fond of that method either...but it seems to be the least evil. I would rather see cut down mags like we used to do here for hunting laws....well, elsewhere in the US... here in Montana, we might even be able to use properly permitted FA weapons. rofl2
There are a few other ways to do it that wouldn't be outwardly hideous. I would compare some of the methods to being as extreme as if California forced Yugo owners to remove the grenade launcher and strip/destroy the threads...and just leave it exposed.
Started new post about CDN pinned magazines. Staying on topic of 49 tula refurb.
Quote from: sabu243 on February 24, 2019, 09:49:23 AM
Justin Hell - The magazine does appear to match and appears to not be a scrubbed force matched replacement, but please fill me in if I'm out to lunch on this:
(https://i.imgur.com/BayaGJ6.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/fovkFQ0.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PaCIP6g.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/P7QRwiQ.jpg)
Oh, Canadaaaaaa! :(
(https://i.imgur.com/jleiM17.jpg)
Very cool to finally see what is going on under the hood. There is a post and spring! Hooray! It's great to know there isn't some totally insane thing going on in there. Can you tell if it seems to be welded in there, or actually part of the floorplate?
It seems as if the modification was to ease the manufacturing process...unless they snapped off like the Canadian follower pin mag mod can easily do. :)
The fact that they still exist probably means it wasn't an actual problem though, and more likely it was just a pain the original way to make.
I am just glad that we don't have to add the 49 follower to the list of (nearly) impossible to find 49 SKS parts. We already have the elusive spike itself, the tiny bottom pinned stock ferrule, the stock, the looped takedown lever, and the pinless floorplate. That is plenty to keep someone from being able to pull off faking one properly without it costing more than finding an original one. Heck, it even seems nearly impossible to get the proper mag to follow it's gun through it's lifetime. I am glad to see this is an exception...in a bittersweet way?
Thank you to everyone for the info and replies. Appreciate it!
Thanks for the education, gents.
Also like the vintage aircraft plug box.
Quote from: sabu243 on February 24, 2019, 12:32:07 PM
Thank you to everyone for the info and replies. Appreciate it!
Sabu,
I have additional information about your carbine, and you may not like it.
I had photos of this gun saved on my computer direct from the WestRifle website. I pulled these photos on 04/19/2016:
(https://i.ibb.co/L8M8h2m/A-1144-receiver-WR.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/PQP62qV/A-1144-right-whole-WR.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/pnNPxbh/A-1144-magazine-WR.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/qRJYDGx/A-1144-left-front-WR.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/8sGjS3C/A-1144-bolt-carrier-WR.jpg)
Of particular interest is the stock when originally listed via WestRifle:
(https://i.ibb.co/yRvFFH0/A-1144-stock-WR.jpg)
WestRifle had this gun on their site a looong time, I grabbed another set of photos on 05/23/18. Different photo, same stock:
(https://i.ibb.co/Ky7zDN7/A-1144-stock2-WR2.jpg)
Now look at your stock:
(https://i.ibb.co/9WzWC45/A-1144-stock-humped.jpg)
It's the same stock, the S/N was left mostly unmolested, though filled in with heavy finish, the old XXX'd numbers were sanded out (you can clearly see where now that you know where to look), and the cartouche and date were added. The stock is the same stock, the toe addition (a separate block that was added to many stock blanks that were just a bit too small to make a full stock) is clearly identical as is the remnants of the little 0 after the AГ1144 S/N.
Obviously between when it was photographed on 5/23/18 and today something happened to that stock. I want to make it clear that I have no information that WestRifle did this, indeed they had it listed with the clearly double XXX'd stock for over two years. "Any" owner between them selling it and and you buying it could have humped it.
We have a member here who was fond of saying "This gun gives me the heebie-jeebies" - this gun does indeed give me the heebie-jeebies. It is clear to me that I can now make this statement with 100% certainty:
"Someone in Canada right now has a Tula star stock cartouche stamp, a 1949Г stamp, the ability to sand and refinish a stock to make it appear to be something that it isn't, and they are actively doing this to SKS45s there right now."
Before I only had circumstantial evidence that this was occurring...for example there were no documented 1956-58 guns with 195XГ dates & cartouches, but they turned up on CGN and were hailed as absolute proof that these guns were indeed made this way. It is clear that the pool of guns in Canada has major issues and I've been absolutely correct in excluding them from my data collection.
We need a smoking gun emoji.
Damn, while it seemed way too good to be true seeing these stocks pop up...it is disheartening to find out that indeed it was.
I have nothing to be upset about, it's a beauty rifle that now has even more of a story!
That's unreal that you happened to have the pictures from West Rifle as well.
Thanks for the update with the new info.
Lots of shenanigans up in the North it seems.
Quote from: sabu243 on March 07, 2019, 10:25:54 AM
I have nothing to be upset about, it's a beauty rifle that now has even more of a story!
That's unreal that you happened to have the pictures from West Rifle as well.
Thanks for the update with the new info.
Lots of shenanigans up in the North it seems.
Good deal! thumb1. As long as you're happy with what you have. The gun is indeed a bonifide '49 as I have many others with the prefix that are untouched.
Some guys collect firearms; they have beautiful collections. I mostly just collect data. You'd be surprised how many new guns people post that I already have a photo of.
There is the fact it is documented in photos that it is at least the stock it was refurbed with. Just with a slight touch of additional refurbing done by a third party. :)
Most folks with these won't be able to ever know for sure...great catch RM!
RM - Data collection is very important when trying to decipher a mystery that is over 50 years old from half way around the world. It will be a constant learning curve as more examples surface and more pieces of the puzzle are assembled. Good on you for your dedication to the cause.
For me, as much as I appreciate the carbine for it's historical value, it is still a nicely blued rifle with a decent looking stock that I will shoot at the range and enjoy.
I like learning the minute and intricate differences between the model years and variations while possibly having someone see something I hadn't is fun!
Wow.
What a catch.
Man alot of nice SkS's have suddenly appeared lately. Very nice piece of Ruski history thumb1
I wonder if Greasemonkey/C13 Mechanic has one of those aircraft spark plug tools yet. rofl2 rofl